My take on the new eMac and new Powerbook

simX

simX

Unofficial Mac Genius
Hmm. Today's new hardware is a mixed bag, in my opinion.

Let's start with the good: the Powerbook. More pixel-pushing, with a higher resolution screen, and a mobility Radeon 7500 with 32 MB of DDRAM are all welcome improvement. The additional 1 MB of backside L3 cache is also very welcome, and should provide a nice boost to the overall performance of the new Powerbook. And the DVI connector is definitely very nice, allowing the Powerbook to connect to Apple's awesome lineup of flat-panel displays. And FINALLY Apple decides to put audio in on their Powerbook, and lets hope it makes the cut to get into the other hardware. The gigabit ethernet is also welcomed, but I thought this was already in the previous generation TiBooks.

The downside of the new TiBooks? They're $200 more expensive across the line: $2499 and $3199. The low-end TiBook used to be $2199 before the addition of the combo drive. I don't think this will affect the sales drastically, especially with all the new additions that give the TiBook much more value.

Now about this eMac. I dunno. "e" stands for education, but I have a few bones to pick. If Apple really wants to have a low-cost machine without all the gizmos but giving at least a processor boost, why not release it to the whole world? I mean, it looks like a nice addition to the lineup and would definitely complement the high-end consumer iMac. But since it's only for education and only education buyers can get it, it kind of confuses the scene. Furthermore, the price WITH the "education discount" IS $999 or $1199, making it still not as attractive as a $749 G3-based 15" CRT iMac.

Phil Schiller said that it might be possible that the eMac would be sold to the general public – but then what would the "e" stand for? "Error"?

Seriously, though. On the low-end, it seems like a good value what with a 17" CRT display and an nVidia GeForce 2MX. Plus, it also gets an audio-in port (which also is good, since now we have the Powerbook and eMac having audio-in; it seems like audio-in should come across the product line, now). But no modem for the low-end? I think Apple could at least have added that in and could have left the price the same. It's understandable that schools in general don't need the modem, but either take it out of the whole line or don't – that's just silly. This low-end also only has a measly CD-ROM drive -- which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but previous G3 based CRT iMacs had CD-RWs for $999.

The high-end one looks nice, too, with a combo drive. However, I don't think that a combo drive and a modem necessitate a $200 price increase. Also weird is that neither the $999 nor the $1199 models appear in Apple's online education store – only a $1249 version (which appears to have the exact same specs as the $1199 one), and a custom-built eMac for $1516 that simply bumps the memory to 512 megs form 128, and adds a nice eMac stand (Apple designed).

Overall, the design of the eMac is nice, too, and the tighter design is welcome (it's depth is less). However, I don't know what Apple's trying to accomplish with just releasing the eMac to educational customers.

I'm kind of baffled. I think that Apple should have just released the eMac to the general public at their current spec list (except giving the low-end a modem). Then Apple could have given education customers an even bigger break (maybe pushing the price down to $899 and $1099, respectively) while opening up the eMac to customers who don't want the iMac's power. That would pose problems with the eMac and iMac competing for the same market, though.

I know the Powerbook update is welcome, despite the higher price. But I think I'll have to wait and see how the eMac does.

UPDATE: If you're an education individual, you CANNOT buy the $999 or $1199 eMac – you must be an educational institution purchasing the eMac in bulk to get the lower prices. This is insane: you can only buy the $1249 or the $1516 models mentioned. Hardly a compelling buy, especially when the iMac starts at $1399. I think Apple made a wrong move with this eMac.

This is a pretty accurate editorial: http://www.insanely-great.com/news.php?id=334
 
Originally posted by simX
That would pose problems with the eMac and iMac competing for the same market, though.
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Exactly. This was designed for what educators demand. And I'm sure large counties will get huge discounts on buying in large balk. Schools almost never pay retail prices, just look at Maine with the iBooks for example.

I do think this would make a nice low end machine, more than nice, actually. But it would cut into iMac sales, and possibly Power Mac, where Apple will be making more profit.

Now, I'm sure if there's enough demand maybe at MYNY we'll see a public option, but I think that will only happen if iMac sales drop too low.
 
I think the eMac makes sense for the educational market. Kids tend to beat the crap out of computers and the fewer moving parts the better. This thing appears to be built like a tank. I hope that's the case. I can also see why the low end wouldn't have a modem. A lot of schools have broadband connections and really have no need for modems.

I think this machine illustrates how Apple marked the death of the CRT a little too soon (not to mention the iMac price hike.)

I do think the prices are pretty high on both the eMac and the TiPB, especially since the processor speeds aren't terribly impressive. They both have their merits though. I'd love to have a looksy at that new Screen on th TiPB.
 
Would an admin please move this back to the Mac News & Rumor Discussion forum? It doesn't belong here, because it's an editorial about newly released Macs.
 
I haven't read any detailed articles yet, so this is just idle speculation.

If I were to design a computer for school use alone, and I'm using an LCD screen, the first thing I'd do is make sure that the screen can't be damaged by poking fingers. The iMac I have at home can be touched without distorting anything, but anything more than a light touch produces funky color distortion. I know this is normal for LCDs -- and I don't spend my time pressing on the screen to see the nifty colors. :) But I imagine that small fingers may be inclined to do so, and I doubt that it does the monitor any good. A nice protective layer of heavy glass may do the trick.

I also would not include a modem across the board. As has been previously noted, few schools use modem connections, and would therefore be a waste for most schools. Considering the numbers of sales, installing useless modems would be a huge expense. Not that all modems are useless for school use, but I'd at least have the option of modem/no modem available.

Finally, I think I'd probably stick with CD-Roms, not CD-RWs. Maybe set up the students with some server space so they can save easily. Of course, this is assuming that the computers are going into lower grade levels. It wasn't until I attended college that I started having projects and assignments that were too large for floppies. So I don't really see the need for CD-RWs until higher grade levels. Maybe it's just me, I'm not entirely convinced of the matter either way.

Anyway, that's my 1.5 cents. It would be two cents but I'm not totally informed on the subject...
 
Apple probably doesn't want to sell to the general public because they want the general public to buy their new Flat Panel iMacs.
 
Exactly.
There is already a bit of overlapping happening between the iMac and G4 tower. This would confuse things even more.
 
I totally understand the thing about the flat-panel displays, and I'm sure that the eMac is robust just because of this.

The things I'm confused about are the modem, the price, and the target.

The modem: Apple decided to take out the modem in the low-end model and keep the modem in for the high-end model. That's silly. What Apple should have done is either leave them in the whole eMac lineup, or taken the whole thing out and allowed education customers to custom-build their eMacs to have modems, if they needed it. That way they could shave a little off the high-end price, too (although I doubt it would be much).

The price: it's still too high. The previous G3 CRT iMacs were priced at $749 and $949. Now, with the $999 eMac, we get no CD-RW drive, no modem, and only 128 MB of RAM (as opposed to 256 MB in the G3 based $999 model). I guess the price hike is because of the 17" CRT, and the G4 processor. It's funny, though, because it seems like Apple is STILL selling the G3-based 15" iMac. Weird.

The target: why does Apple restrict the eMac to the education market, and then AGAIN to educational institutions? An individual can only buy an eMac priced at $1249 or $1516. That's not a compelling buy, since the G4-based iMac at $1599 is a much better deal, IMHO.

If I were Apple, this is what I would have done: released the eMac to all educational buyers, whether institutional or not, and have the price start at $899 and the high-end model at $1099.

I just think Apple is confusing the whole lineup: now we have the G4 CRT eMac, the G4 flat-panel iMac, the G3 CRT iMac, and the PowerMac as all desktop solutions. It's just weird and confusing.
 
Originally posted by simX

If I were Apple, this is what I would have done: released the eMac to all educational buyers, whether institutional or not, and have the price start at $899 and the high-end model at $1099.

I just think Apple is confusing the whole lineup: now we have the G4 CRT eMac, the G4 flat-panel iMac, the G3 CRT iMac, and the PowerMac as all desktop solutions. It's just weird and confusing.
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Hmm, it seems like you're proposing that the eMac should be widely available then you're saying that there are too many alternatives.

I agree with Apple's lineup. They no longer lead the education market, Dell does. Their offering was old and and slow not cheap enough to make up the difference.

The eMac helps them compete by adressing two major concerns, 1) speed, 2) screen size.

The problem with making it more widely available is that it will canabalize the sales of their other desktops. By not having a superdrive I don't want one. However, I can see somebody else buying it to save money.

Vanguard

PS Besides, charging $1000 for a text editor is crazy. :)
 
Originally posted by vanguard


Hmm, it seems like you're proposing that the eMac should be widely available then you're saying that there are too many alternatives.
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Well, yeah, basically. If Apple thinks there should be a low-cost computer that has a lot of power, why not just allow anyone to buy it, instead of just educational institutions?

And right now, Apple's education lineup is confusing. Like I said, there are the G3 and G4 iMacs, as well as the new G4 eMac. What's particularly confusing is the blurry area between the low-end iMac and the high-end eMac.

I agree with Apple's lineup. They no longer lead the education market, Dell does. Their offering was old and and slow not cheap enough to make up the difference.
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Actually, no. Dell was briefly the education leader, but Apple quickly regained that position.

The eMac helps them compete by adressing two major concerns, 1) speed, 2) screen size.
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I guess...

The problem with making it more widely available is that it will canabalize the sales of their other desktops. By not having a superdrive I don't want one. However, I can see somebody else buying it to save money.
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I understand that it will cannibalize sales of other desktop offerings, but Apple has REALLY blurred the line already for education customers. I mean, you could either go with a G3-based iMac that has a CD-RW drive at $999, or you could forget about the CD-RW drive and instead get a G4 processor, 17" display, and no modem for the same price. Of course, you could get the high-end eMac with a combo drive. But then why would anyone get the low-end iMac over the high-end eMac? The low-end iMac has only a CD-RW drive, has the same speed processor, has a smaller 15" flat-panel display, and is $200 more expensive. Of course, then there's the mid-range and high-end iMacs. But then why not just go ahead and get the PowerMac G4 for $1599 and get a cheap CRT monitor?

It's even further blurred when you consider education INDIVIDUALS, because they can only get the $1299 or $1516 eMac, making the $1399 and $1599 iMacs more attractive buys.

See what I mean? It's just waaaaay too confusing, although I see the need for a high-power-low-price computer like the eMac. However, the power is enough to have it compete directly with the low-end eMac. So people will be confused.

Also, regular consumers are left out in the cold when it comes to a high-power-low-price computer. They have the option of only the G3 or G4 iMacs, the former being underpowered, and the latter being expensive.

I'm just confused as to what Apple is trying to do with the eMac.
 
I haven't read the editorial articles yet, as far as proffessional opinions, etc. My gripe is with the name. It makes me think of both Emacs and eMachines...both of which I dislike. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against Emacs for what it is, I just dislike command-line stuff, and using the terminal in general. And eMachines are just annoying. When I was in high school, my school bought some, and they were nothing but trouble.
~Ryan
 
If I were in charge at Apple, I would make the thing fully customizable for bulk orders (over 50? over 100?). i.e. you could get any sort of optical drive or none at all, modem or not, internal hard disk or not (netboot), gigabit ethernet (especially useful if you're going diskless, probably). Anything I'm missing.

Right now their cusomization options suck - swivel stand or not, wireless card or not, how much RAM. That's about it. Mind you, I was pretending to be a student at some college in Nebraska. Maybe if you pretend to be a school you get a better set of options. Anyone have the patience to find out?
 
Originally posted by simX
The modem: Apple decided to take out the modem in the low-end model and keep the modem in for the high-end model. That's silly. What Apple should have done is either leave them in the whole eMac lineup, or taken the whole thing out and allowed education customers to custom-build their eMacs to have modems, if they needed it. That way they could shave a little off the high-end price, too (although I doubt it would be much).
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I think the low end one is for networks, so the schools/colleges wouldn't need a modem, and the high end is for students to purchase who are much more likely to need a modem. Although custom building would make it a lot easier.
 
Flat panels don't make sense in a lab setting. They're too light and easily moved/stolen/knocked over.

CRT displays are more feasible. So- up until now administrators were forced to choose between stripped down powermacs and cheap displays (which they couldn't get covered under their apple support packages since they didn't get them from apple) or the the older G3 iMacs, assuming they wanted to avoid the flat panel iMac due to screen size (too small) or the other problems of theft/etc..

The eMac fills in a gap. They can get good machines with fast processors and the optical drive they want (except the superdrive... not sure why that isn't an option) without paying a premium for flat panels that they don't want.
 
anyone can purchase an eMac. Simply go in, type in the zip code of your past or present HS (I would recommend) and all options are yours. There are no background checks whatsoever.

I did this for Mac OS X. But, I really didn't do anything wrong since I had my teacher buy it under her name and then give it to me.:D

Seems rather wrong that HS students shouldn't be able to get a discount.:rolleyes:

Just goes to show, if you're really intent on giving Apple your money, there are options.
:p

I would imagine iMac/G5(please) speedbumps at MWNY to help differentiate the products. I would estimate Dual 1.5Ghz in the tower, and 1.0-1.1Ghz in the iMac. The eMac would remain the same.
 
I am student, and I know for a fact that you cant give students the new iMac, in fact you cant give them anything with an LCD. It will get destroyed. Thats why this new eMac thing works. I agree with simX on most points about this thing however I was talking to one of the Art Department Chairs today and he says this thing is exactly what the Tech department is looking for for the students, mainly because of the G4 and 17in display. They held off on buying the new iMacs because they figured they might get destroyed, which was wise. Kids play with things. This eMac appears to be very durable and perfect for students. I think this was a good call made by Apple. If they release this thing to the public it undoubtedly will cut into iMac sales. That would be a very foolish decision. Steve spent half an hour at Macworld in January explaing why Apple was dropping the CRT off the consumer product line, why bring it back in. They just need this thing for education, they made the right move!
 
Well, maybe it's good from an education standpoint to have this many options.

But what about the regular consumer who is not involved in education? What powerful and cheap solution do they get? Currently, they can either buy the underpowered G3 iMac or the high-priced G4 iMac. What fills in THAT gap?
 
'High priced' iMac?

The low end one has a very nice flat panel and the same processor as the eMac for $1400. It's for home users... it's great for home users.

For $400 more it has a superdrive and a faster chip (+ ram and HD). I don't think the iMac is high priced.

If you balk at $1400... get the classic iMac for $800.
 
I understand that it will cannibalize sales of other desktop offerings, but Apple has REALLY blurred the line already for education customers. I mean, you could either go with a G3-based iMac that has a CD-RW drive at $999, or you could forget about the CD-RW drive and instead get a G4 processor, 17" display, and no modem for the same price. Of course, you could get the high-end eMac with a combo drive. But then why would anyone get the low-end iMac over the high-end eMac? The low-end iMac has only a CD-RW drive, has the same speed processor, has a smaller 15" flat-panel display, and is $200 more expensive. Of course, then there's the mid-range and high-end iMacs. But then why not just go ahead and get the PowerMac G4 for $1599 and get a cheap CRT monitor?
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But don't forget schools are buying in high volume. They don't care about the small differences in a single item but remember, orders make in 1 eMac and 10 eMac and even 100 eMac are totally different!
 
if the eMac was released to the public, the iMac would become the next Cube?:confused:

The problem with Apple (and my fiancee will back me up on this) is: they are seriously flawed when it comes to marketing strategy! They are such a vastly superior creative company, that everytime they have a new idea or design, they just wanna get it out to show people. Marketing always comes as an afterthought.

Really, I run a design business and now I am wondering which damn machine I should be upgrading! It should be that there is only one option in my mind, and that's the workstations! But they are not much different to the iMacs, and now even closer to the eMacs!

Just one final point about Apples marketing: How many tv ads have you seen promoting apples products? (iMac etc.) How many of these ads have informed people that Apple has probably the most simple and best operating system in the world? duh!

:(
 
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